I’ve been attacking this attendance problem that we’ve been having from multiple angles. The past several weeks we have been consistently short by about 3 or 4 people to do the super hard part of the game. I even spent a couple hours compiling a list of other guilds that we could possibly merge with based on their schedule and their progress in game. And so tonight I started going down the list reaching out to see if anyone would talk to me about possibly teaming up. I talked to a couple different guilds, some didn’t seem to be a good fit due to a difference in schedules and some had different goals in the game. Most felt that they couldn’t accommodate so many people and wanted to continue on their current path.
One guild that I talked to stuck out in my mind in a big way. It was a great example of harassment that we women players encounter from time to time. First impressions do matter and this one sucked. I started the conversation in chat and they asked me to hop on their voice chat server. I joined their channel which had 5 other guys and said “hello” with my distinctly female voice. I was responded to by a some sort of joke about male genitalia, for which I will not repeat followed by snickers and my silence. My first thought was ‘they’re guy gamers, whatever. I’m familiar with this type of talk.‘ What I should have done was said “oh sorry I got to go” or made up some other excuse and left. Instead, I talked logistics with this group, the guild leader who just tried to mess with me. In the moment I felt like I was in control of the situation but after setting up a time to play together this week and left the chat I had some serious regret for even continuing the conversation.
It took me all of 10 minutes to come to my senses. The more that I thought about it the more sketched out I became. The first words out of this guild leader’s mouth after he heard me speak was something sexist and gross. That stuff doesn’t usually bother me but I’m probably be putting myself in a bad position if I were to continue playing with the dirtbag. I quickly messaged the scummy guild leader and canceled the plans for our guild to play together. I knew in my heart that this wasn’t going to be a group that I would be happy playing with. I felt stupid for putting myself in a position like that with guys who took pleasure in pushing my buttons. I’ve dealt with people that don’t show me any sort of respect before and it’s not something I would want to willingly be a part of.
It’s taking time, but I’m adjusting my thinking about what types of behaviors are acceptable to me when I’m playing video games. I have, on occasion, used poor judgement and gotten myself into some uncomfortable situations. And this all is part of life and part of growing up and learning. I’m still educating myself and adjusting to a higher standard that I want for myself and those that I play with. Life’s too short to play games with people that treat you poorly.
Diary of a Guild Leader 
I’m sorry you had such a bad experience. But fortunate it happened before your guilds got together. It doesn’t sound like a good fit at all.
As a woman myself, I must admit, that I never felt that bothered by those kind of comments, but with time, I realized, I had just come to silently accept, that that is how I was being talked to. Which is so wrong. Because it does bother me.
I wonder if the, is the English word jargon, too? Has gone unnoticed for so long, that young men have simply been brought up to think it’s fine, even cool in their friends eyes, to act that way.
As for activity, it is my hope, that Blizzcon and a date for 8.1 might cause more interest in the game again. Fingers crossed.
Good luck to your guild 🙂
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I’m bothered by the fact that misogynist comment seem the norm to me. I’ve been reading a lot lately about other women and their experiences playing games. And when I’m in the moment the negativity just seems normal, partly because I’ve been dealing with it for the 15 years that I’ve been a girl gamer. I’m trying to be more aware of what is being said to me or to the other females that I play with and is it OK? Of course to me, it’s never been ok for my players to insult or ridicule another player but maybe I need to raise the bar on acceptable behavior and that will help us all have a better experience going forward.
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Awareness about it is a good step 🙂
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While I cannot even begin to imagine what you have gone through over the years, I can share what we have done in the past. There is another guild on my server, they were a bit more focused on the more difficult aspects of raiding. We both had great groups of people, but also would reach points where we needed that extra body or 3. I had talked to the GM in the past, and we had collaborated on a server wide event. I got invited to his vent one night to talk about raiding, how some guilds were poaching people and what we could do. The first thing he said to me was, I know we’ve talked through chat and messages, but I thought you should know, I’m gay. When I immediately replied and? He was speechless for a second, then said, you don’t have s problem with that? Of course not. What does you being gay have to do with the person you are. You are a great guy, you are friendly to those not in your guild, you treat people in my guild that have run with you with respect. Why should that matter.
Well, I wasn’t sure since you’re an older white dude.
That took me a second to answer. I said look, yes, I’m what you say, but I have a nephew that is gay, I have a cousin that is a lesbian, I do not look at them any differently than anyone else. Everyone should’ve allowed to be with a person they love or brings them happiness.
That was met with a “damn, the world needs more people like you”.
As two of the larger guilds on our servers and there is a 3rd we work with, we all have different raid nights, we all have people that are probably just a little better than the content we are working on, and have let our people know when one of the other two need to fill spots, we are the first to be asked. And all of us hold our people accountable. It has allowed us to get through content and not have to call off a night for lack of people. Guild mergers are a difficult thing, but perhaps you may do better working with a similar guild to yours where you will both benefit. Certainly you may get people that switch guilds, but as long as everyone does so without leaving on bad terms it allows two guilds to advance further.
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Boys are pigs.
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It is a weird and very terrible thing to experience, for me because it reminds me that there ARE people who think that way and can’t act like normal human beings around women. Also it is difficult to react “in the moment” to these things…usually takes time to hit you.
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I think this interaction wouldn’t have happened the way it did if the guy wasn’t trying to show off to his friends. He was a “funny” guy I guess.
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I know that I have been a GM for quite a number of years and it still surprises me to hear someone say “The GM is a woman?” – I usually just chuckle and keep on going because it can be unusual on some servers. There have been instances when I have rocked out with some pretty salty words on occasion – women don’t usually talk that way – that usually nails it down that I’m not your typical Mom.
I’ve been married for close to 40 years, have children and grandchildren that play WoW as well – it’s not all bad. I’m still surprised that some people would have issues with a GM/GL would be female because it is 2018 – in naiveté, I had hoped that things were better now than when I first started playing the game.
Hang in there and let this stuff roll off your back and keep on going – if something makes you angry, let them know it and move on. *hugs*
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It’s such a weird position to be in. On the one hand, I doubt any of these people I talk to would outright say that they have a problem with female leaders, but actions are a lot more telling.
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I’ve played MUDs in 1998 with female guild leaders and terrifyingly hardcore female players (one of whom would get her 8 year old son to take over and play her character in fights from time to time, like a prototype of a gold farmer trainee 😉 )
Not sure how this is still new or surprising in 2018.
I’l be interested to see if the amount of sexist behavior differs across countries/timezones, indicating a cultural component, or if it’s age/maturity related, or both, and by how much. The MUD I played was based in Toronto, Canada, and I play in South East Asian/Australian timezones which seem a little more egalitarian culturally than other timezones (though some of it is immediately ruined by age-related immature behavior or the general Aussie tendency to curse like a sailor to indicate friendship. 🙂 )
Wonder if anyone has done any research studies on this.
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Anything that I’ve found out on the web is highly anecdotal. I think it’s hard to quantify since it’s not really a measurable thing (like wages in the workplace). Can they do official studies? Sure they can! But my guess is that any research group would be looking at more general bullying since that is a hot topic vs. women treated differently while playing video games. It’s all about who wants to spend money to fund such things.
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